From comedy and creativity to mental health: The mainstay comic tells us why this hour means something different.
Check out the full interview on EsquireME here.
Bonus Questions
I loved the backdrop on stage behind you. Can you talk to me a little about the reason for those changing colors and the art work that inspired the set?
NB: The artwork that inspired it is an installation at the Hammer Museum in Westwood, California. I think it’s [made of] yarn and it looks like blood vessels. So I pitched that to the production designer and he was like, “you know, there’s a way to do it this way”.
People are guessing that at first it’s trees or roots, and then it’s synapses and then it’s blood vessels. That’d be my guess at what happened. The green is the trees, the synapses in the end, the red is blood vessels. It gets a little dark at the end, a little devilish, but that ended up being the poster which I think is an attractive poster. But it is like, a little intense.
Comics often say that working clean is stand-up on hard-mode. How does writing for All That and Kenan and Kell compare to directing and writing for something like the Chappelle show?
NB: I wasn’t good at writing for Kenan and Kel for that reason. I couldn’t really get in that mind frame. You’re either predisposed to do it or you’re not. I don’t think Sebastian Maniscalco and Jim Gaffigan and Jerry Seinfeld and Nate Bargatze are better at comedy than Chris Rock, Dave Chappelle, and Bill Burr- sorry fellas.
I think it’s a choice and they both have huge upsides in with Sebastian, literally it’s eight year olds and grandparents. Same with Gaffigan, same with Nate. You just allow for a far bigger market. I don’t think it’s harder.
Between the index card you’d keep in your pocket of impressive things you’d done career-wise as a 30 year old, and the gratitude list you make every-day now, can you talk about the importance of perspective in the life of an artist?
NB: The list of a 30-year-old, that was more to try to keep myself afloat in a sea of negative self talk. I felt bad and I’d go like, “but you wrote whatever, you directed the Rick James sketch, you wrote that joke or this joke”. And that would help but it’s kind of short money, it’s a bit of a sugar high. The one in 2006 wasn’t a gratitude list, that was a self defense list.
[The current gratitude list] is more about getting some perspective about my life, and about my process of growth and learning and all that stuff. The more I do it, the less negative self talk I have.
A couple months ago, I would write like, “Thank you for the talent and thank you for the money” and all that stuff, and now it’s morphed into, “I’m grateful for the inner shifts in me, I’m grateful for the growth, I’m grateful for the peace, I’m grateful for the ability to connect”. It’s just a weird shift I’ve noticed where I’m not like, “I got three Netflix specials, mother-f****er!”.
I’m very grateful that I’ve been given this consciousness and I get to be one way and shift it and grow in that direction. Within the “writing the list”, I haven’t been writing, “I’m grateful that I have a podcast and I get enough respect that Jerry Seinfeld will do it”. I’m less concerned with that.
I don’t say any of this as “I’m healed, and I’m better than you”. I say it as a thing I’ve been doing that’s like, “if you tape your ankle up, it doesn’t hurt as much when you run”. It’s more just a DIY YouTube tutorial of like, “hey, say something to nice yourself”. Instead of, you know, “look at your car, bro!”
Crazy Good is a departure from your quote on quote “emo-comedy” persona, and you start the special by saying “I have some terrible news, I feel pretty great”.
If that changes though, do you think you’re going to keep the personal stuff out of your sets for right now, and if so, do you think you’d ever try another medium for when you’re not feeling great?
NB: I’m not opposed to any of it. I’ll do whatever I feel inspired to do or feel like I can do well. I don’t have any intention of like, “I find this comedy limiting”. It’s pretty great and you can say whatever you want but I’m not going to be tied to a brand of “but the people want happy’. If I feel good, I’ll do specials that seem like I feel good.
Something that I’ve noticed about your last three specials is the different ways you perform in reference to the microphone. Three Mics is the obvious stand out and it’s explained within the premise of the show, but for Blocks you went for a Lapel Mic and returned to just the one in your Hand for Crazy Good. Is there a reason you made those decisions for those hours, and does it affect the way you perform?
NB: Within 3 mics, it’s on three stands and I would take it out for the stand-up part. But even on that one, Chris Rock was like, “you know, you need to stay in that area for the premise to work. Like you can’t veer too far, you need stay physically in the standard area”. Even if I was pacing, I had to like be in a small circle.
Blocks– I like performing with the lapel mic. The problem is my shoulders slump if I’m not holding something. It’s funny, sometimes I would see a clip of Blocks and I’m like, “Hey, cheer up Chief”.
Having a mic [in hand] is animating. I also think it’s interesting that Crazy Good did better than Blocks, and I figured this might happen- Because there’s a microphone in the poster, so you know what it is. Whereas with Blocks, it’s just my head, so you’re like “what is that a psychological thriller?”.
Neal you strike me as a really good person to have in your corner. Between the idea of comedy being a brotherhood or a family and Katt Williams bringing back beef to the game, where do you stand on a comics relationship to their peers?
NB: I was hoping for more “us” and it turns out that there’s a lot of “me”, and not a ton of “us”.
I would say I’ve been disappointed by the lack of “us”, but I’m sure I’ve disappointed people, by the lack of “us”. So I can’t be like, “I’m a saint, and they’re all sinners”.
I get it though. We’re all vying for attention and money and most people don’t move out to LA to be on a team or help out a group. I’ve disappointed people as well. It’s kind of the human problem of like, these vessels are solo. [In comedy] You make one man shows and one woman shows, there’s very few two man shows.
Being a writer yourself, you always give credit to anybody who gives you an idea or a tag. Can you give me any early horror stories from the writer’s room? Was there a moment that shot you away from the gig and onto stage?
NB: It was more that I did stand-up a little bit before and during Chappelle Show- which was born out of writing and pitching movies, and then them buying them and not making them, or note-ing us to death or whatever.
It was more just like, “I’m pretty sure I’m funny. I know I’m funny”. I would like a way to prove that or just remind myself that it’s true.
And by the way, I think this is the first time after 20 or 30 years- I finally feel like anyone who says something negative on me will just seem stupid. I think I made my case pretty well over the last 30 years for being decent at comedy. You can say I’m an a**hole or whatever you want to say, but I don’t think you can say I’m not good at it.
It wasn’t even writer’s rooms. It was more producers deciding what was funny and what wasn’t or what was good and what wasn’t. If I pitch Ellen a joke, or you know if I would pitch Dave joke, or Rock or whoever, and they don’t want to do it- I’m like, “You’ve got to jump out of the airplane. So if you want to pack the parachute/if you don’t trust my parachute, I get that”. But if you’re a producer, just guessing? It was just like, “why am I asking people that are incapable of knowing?”.
I don’t want to make this an article about like, “the suits” though because I’m basically divorced from all of that. All the suits I’ve dealt with eventually just either got out of the way or quickly got out of the way on Chappelle Show. With stand-up there’s been virtually no pushback.
Who are Neal Brennan’s comedy GOATs? I’m curious to your answer more than anyone’s cause you’re such an illustrious name that you personally know most other people’s GOATs.
NB: I have it written down because I always forget people.
What is it, a 17 person list?
NB: It’s more than that. Dave Chappelle, George Carlin, Richard Pryor, Bill Cosby, Mort Sahl, Joan Rivers, Dick Gregory, Chris Rock, Patrice O’Neal Wanda Sykes, Sarah Silverman, Louis C. K. Brian Regan, Steve Martin, Bill Hicks, Woody Allen, Mitch Hedberg, Phyllis Diller, Earthquake, Dave Attell, Kathleen Madigan, Daniel Tosh, Bill Burr, Jim Jefferies, Ali Wong, John Mulaney, Sebastian Maniscalco, Ellen DeGeneres, Norm McDonald, Nate Bargatze, Rodney Dangerfield, Jon Stewart, Ray Romano…
So your GOAT list is like if I asked ChatGPT who the best comedians are.
NB: I mean, I could explain to you why they’re great better than ChatGPT but it’s like when people ask, “what’s your favorite Chappelle Show sketch?”.
I don’t know, Rick James? Blind White Supremacist? There’s one called Jury Selection that me and Dave have both come to realize was the best one, but it’s not the most popular one. It’s popular but it’s not [Michael Jackson’s] Thriller. It’s not Thriller, but it is Human Nature.